Brain damage
Tue Sep 15, 2009 16:01 EST (UTC -5)My right brain and left brain need to sit down and have a chat sometime.
Sometimes I'm caught having to choose between what's logically sound and what feels good. It doesn't have to be anything big; even little things can tear me to pieces.
For a while now, my parents have been giving me scratch-off lottery tickets as small gifts. Playing the lottery is a bad idea if you want to win. It is a system designed to make money; otherwise, it wouldn't exist. As I've been more and more concerned about saving money, I asked my parents to stop buying me lottery tickets and to maybe give me the money they would have otherwise spent on the tickets instead. Of course, I regretted it as soon as the words came out of my mouth.
But scratch-offs were fun, they said. They didn't sound too happy, so I backpedaled. I had wanted to categorically reject all gambling because it's a bad idea that makes people lose money, but I compromised myself because my emotions got the better of me. I feel like I should be able to say, "Please don't buy me lottery tickets, do something useful with your money instead," but on the other hand, I want my parents to be happy. Also, seeing if you've won can be entertaining, and the proceeds of the Florida Lottery fund education.
There are always two sides to every issue. Why do they both have to have merit? It only makes life more difficult for those of us who want to make principled decisions.
And then there are the Hare Krishna types who serve lunch at my university. Krishna Lunch is considered an institution because they've been doing it for many years. People like the food, and it comes at a competitive price. Every day around lunchtime, students line up on the plaza to be served while Hare Krishnas play their Hare Krishna music and chant Hare Krishna.
I've had Krishna Lunch once or twice. It was pretty tasty. I might like to take advantage of their cheap lunch offers more often, but I'm concerned about who I give my money to and what it says about me. I'm obviously not too keen on giving my money to a religious organization because then they have that much more of an ability to spread their religious nonsense.
In my research, I've found that Krishna Lunch is a nonprofit, which puts me at ease somewhat. But there's still another issue that I think is important. I feel that if I'm caught with one of their paper plates full of unidentifiable food, there should be some kind of disclaimer above my head stating that I don't necessarily endorse the beliefs or practices of the organization.
I guess I might as well go through with it; I don't think anyone would judge me. I should be more concerned about whether I would judge myself. And I did eat at a Chick-fil-A recently, which is like giving money to a church (and getting a crappy sandwich and delicious fries in return). But what would you do if you were me?
Less money, mo' problems.
Slate asks: Why Do We Call Galileo Galilei by His First Name? (Via J-Walk Blog)
This chart could be handy for me now that I'm dabbling in buying perishable food: The Table of Condiments That Periodically Go Bad. (Via All About Me - And Then Some)
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25 comments
#1 by Fan: Tue Sep 15, 2009 16:56 EST (UTC -5)
You should try asking people in the Krishna Lunch line about Krishna beliefs. I think you'd find that a lot of customers don't know that much about the organization they're monetarily supporting.
That being said, I don't think buying a product from a company indicates that one necessarily supports the company's actions. I think that some people will buy products from companies whether or not they approve of, or are aware of, the company's recent actions as long as the product is available for a good value. (Of course, the word 'value' is a cop-out word that takes into account a number of crazy variables, such as social reputation for purchasing from a certain company for 'brand name', etc.) I sure as hell don't know what every company I buy from does with my money. It's a lot to know!
Not that ignorance is the answer here, but I hope that you're right in saying that people will not assume your (or my) support of organized religion based on the purchase of a few cheap (and good) meals. :P
Love the blog, keep writing!
#2 by Luke: Tue Sep 15, 2009 17:51 EST (UTC -5)
All this anti-American talk in one day, and more on the week after that socialist "competition" nonsense earlier. I suppose corporations do things, but they don't have values except to make money. If anything, you should value Chick-fil-A over the Hare Hare Hare folks BECAUSE they value money. Non-profit- huh.
Great article on Italian surnames though.
#3 by kristen: Tue Sep 15, 2009 18:03 EST (UTC -5)
i personally wouldn't read too much into being caught eating krishna food and not lining up your beliefs with theirs. honestly i never even think that all (or most) of the people eating krishna food practice the religion. the point is, krishna food is delicious. cheap. AND all-you-can-eat. need i say more? that being said, we should go together sometime! i haven't been there in a year and it hurts my heart.
#4 by Wendy: Tue Sep 15, 2009 20:24 EST (UTC -5)
Bumper sticker on my car: "There Are More Than Two Sides"....I have a mood ring that turns colors all the time....I am many years older than you and have found life both harder and easier (and much more lush and wonder-filled) when I left Kansas (B & W) and arrived in Oz (color). Celebrate diversity, eat everything, enjoy the "hope" of your scratch ticket and support education!
#5 by Luke: Tue Sep 15, 2009 21:06 EST (UTC -5)
Both sides don't always have merit. Have you heard of Time Cube?
#6 by Robert: Wed Sep 16, 2009 00:37 EST (UTC -5)
Don't be afraid about supporting the Krishna movement when you pay them for a plate of food at a wholesale price. I know they use the best ingredients so it's real deal for the people who enjoy their vegetarian lunch meal. Remember that the servants of God are to be supported. Americans are too caught up in worshiping their movie stars, politicians, sports heros etc.. Man the writer is too mental. Chill and enjoy a good meal and let it be.
#7 by Kate: Wed Sep 16, 2009 12:35 EST (UTC -5)
Robert Chaldini wrote about financial success of Hare Krishna organization in America very interestingly in his book "Influence: The Psychology of Persuasion". I highly recommend this book to everyone. So, even after I started to feel disgusting with Krishna people's policy of making money after reading this book, I'd never think about what does my provider of anything do, I care only about products and services I pay for. For example, I don't like buying anything from Asian people in Russia. But it's not because they make money on drugs and they sell clothes/vegetables/anything just as a cover. No. I just don't like the quality of the products they sell and their ugly behaviour and appearance. Anyway, there is still something to think about. But we can't control everything. It's the reason to let things be and not to think about every little step you do. :) Btw, I'm curious about Krishna lunch, haha. I'll definitely try it :P
#8 by Jordon Kalilich: Wed Sep 16, 2009 18:16 EST (UTC -5)
What a discussion I've started. Everybody gets a "+5, Insightful" so far. The general consensus is that I should buy from them because they're good people or because it doesn't really matter. I still side with the latter.
I like you, Fan, and I have a feeling I know you. I'm not quite as fond of you, Robert, because you called me mental. I don't doubt the quality of the food itself. And although I'm an American, I worship nothing, and I don't believe there's a god that the Hare Krishnas could be serving. The lack of empirical evidence for the existence of gods suggests that it's all in their heads.
So, nobody has anything to say about the Periodic Table of Condiments?
#9 by kristen: Wed Sep 16, 2009 23:15 EST (UTC -5)
if you're really fishing for responses to that link... i'll have to admit i looked up the expiration date for hummus. not bad!
#10 by Joshua McGee: Fri Sep 18, 2009 01:58 EST (UTC -5)
So, McGee's First Law resurfaces (I wouldn't be so bold were you not a reader):
And here is a friend and me, recently, on the lottery:
Chill and enjoy a good meal and let it be.
Only as long as the trains run on time, Robert. Only as long as the trains run on time.
In my research, I've found that Krishna Lunch is a nonprofit, which puts me at ease somewhat.
Why? As someone who's started one, all you have to do is convince a clerk in an office in the state capital that you promote scholarly pursuits and don't do anything too sneaky.
There are always two sides to every issue. Why do they both have to have merit?
No, I would argue that presupposing a dichotomy is itself one of the bad thought habits that get us into trouble. Usually there are manifold sides, including the "universal" and "null" hypotheses. But even if you can only discern two sides -- or even if there can be proven to be only two sides, which is harder -- the burden of proof is on you that there is an excluded middle. There can be an excluded middle in a formal proposition, but most of our propositions are anything but. And -- this is both exciting and maddening -- some propositions can be phrased that are nonsense, to which the only response is to unask the question, or should have a determinable answer, but omega-incompleteness guarantees that we won't be able to evaluate the truth of the question within our chosen framework (damn, still haven't sent you that book I keep promising to ... um ... send you.)
I had a philosophy professor who began many of his answers "Well, yes and no...." We ribbed him about it. He replied, "The answer is 'yes and no' when the question is flawed."
#11 by Joshua McGee: Fri Sep 18, 2009 02:04 EST (UTC -5)
My right brain and left brain need to sit down and have a chat sometime. Sometimes I'm caught having to choose between what's logically sound and what feels good. It doesn't have to be anything big; even little things can tear me to pieces.
#12 by Clai: Fri Sep 18, 2009 06:18 EST (UTC -5)
I've been to the Hare Krishna services, they're neat, but I'm not gonna be converted any day soon. And you don't intend for it to be a statement to eat there, so it isn't.
#13 by Luke: Fri Sep 18, 2009 16:38 EST (UTC -5)
McGee's First Law sounds awfully familiar. You don't work for Douglas Hofstadter, do you?
#14 by Jordon Kalilich: Fri Sep 18, 2009 17:05 EST (UTC -5)
Josh, my attitude toward the lottery seems to have shifted toward your own. I guess I can tolerate people playing the game—it's their money, after all—but I probably wouldn't be caught doing it myself.
I guess I don't know about anything non-profits. I just had sort of a vague idea that such organizations don't pocket their, um, profits, from which I inferred that Krishna Lunch wouldn't be using my money to promote their religion (besides the act of serving the lunch itself; you can hear that Krishna music from a long way away).
But it seems that Vedder says it best. (And I wouldn't have known that if I hadn't glanced at the HTML. Josh, you may be the only person I've ever seen to use the cite attribute of the blockquote tag.)
#15 by Joshua McGee: Fri Sep 18, 2009 18:13 EST (UTC -5)
McGee's First Law sounds awfully familiar. You don't work for Douglas Hofstadter, do you?
You are the first person to ever pick up on that. And it's a Hofstadter book I keep intending to send to Jordon.
you may be the only person I've ever seen to use the cite attribute of the blockquote tag
And shame on browsers for not popping up a "tooltip" on hover. Next time I'll add a citation in the text. You can go and add "[Eddie Vedder -ed.]" if you would like.
#16 by Jordon Kalilich: Fri Sep 18, 2009 18:16 EST (UTC -5)
For what it's worth (probably very little now), I picked up on the Hofstadter reference too. He wrote Goedel, Escher, Bach and has his eponymous law which is something like that, and that's all I know.
#17 by Joshua McGee: Fri Sep 18, 2009 18:18 EST (UTC -5)
He wrote Goedel, Escher, Bach
Have you read it?
#18 by Jordon Kalilich: Fri Sep 18, 2009 18:20 EST (UTC -5)
Nope!
#19 by Joshua McGee: Fri Sep 18, 2009 18:22 EST (UTC -5)
Seriously, Jordon, you are going to read it and say "Where has this book been all my life?!" And the response will be "on the library's shelves".
I don't recommend this book to everyone. I am recommending it to you, and we've corresponded for, what, how many years? May I send you a copy?
#20 by Jordon Kalilich: Fri Sep 18, 2009 18:42 EST (UTC -5)
You could send me a copy, but I could also go check it out at the library and save you a little dough. My university probably has it.
#21 by Joshua McGee: Fri Sep 18, 2009 18:47 EST (UTC -5)
I could also go check it out at the library
Then what are you doing wasting time chatting with me? Vas-y! :-)
#22 by Luke: Fri Sep 18, 2009 20:23 EST (UTC -5)
I found GEB to be less of a revelation than I expected it to be. It's just a fad.
#23 by Joshua McGee: Fri Sep 18, 2009 20:46 EST (UTC -5)
Yeah, but that would be, if your statement had any truth, "fad for the last 30 years", which suggests some longevity.
I wrote a rather obsequious email to Hofstadter in 1995 explaining that, before the book, I had never found someone whose interests matched mine in so many disparate domains, and how people had almost convinced me that I was simply weird. He responded, measuredly, that he was glad I had "felt some kinship with him". I haven't met him, but if/when I do, I'll mention the email and see if he remembers. My guess is "not specifically", because I expect that he received a vast number of boilerplate letters from undergrads.
Here's the really ass thing to say: if you didn't find GEB a revelation, you aren't the intended audience. But that's OK. Pearl Jam, Yeats, Chopin, and Neal Stephenson aren't for everyone either. You'll have your own examples that don't overlap mine. We don't need to shit in each other's sandboxes with dismissive adverbial wankery, to VitaMix my metaphors.
#24 by Joshua: Thu Mar 18, 2010 03:14 EST (UTC -5)
So ... have you read it yet? :-)
#25 by Jordon Kalilich: Thu Mar 18, 2010 08:50 EST (UTC -5)
Thanks for reminding me; you already know how forgetful I am.
My university's library has two copies, one of which is lost. I've put in a request for the other.